The Fewest or More Numerous?

[Sandy]

Exodus 1
7) And the children of Israel were fruitful and swarmed and multiplied and became very, very strong (or numerous); and the land was filled with them.
8) And a new king arose over Egypt, who had not known Joseph.
9) And he said to his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are abundant and stronger (or more numerous) than we.
11) And they put over them slavemasters in order to afflict them...
12) And the more they afflicted them, the more they multiplied and the more they spread. And they were afraid before the children of Israel.
20) ...and the people increased and were very strong (or numerous).

Deuteronomy 7:7
YHUH did not set his love on you or choose you because you were more in number, for you were the FEWEST of all peoples.

[Stranger]

A point in time...

IMHO, I think that it is a point in time. from 70 or so to the hundreds of thousands that left Egypt. The Israelites were known to have very large families, too. A few years ago I did a math projection of how many children were needed per family in so many generations to make up the number of Israelites that left Egypt and I can't remember the formula that I used. It is a simple formula but I have to look it up to give you a more qualifying answer.

Isaiah 51:2 * look to Abraham, your father, and to Sarah, who gave you birth. When I called him he was but one, and I blessed him and made him many.

[Sandy]

Hi Stranger
I had not yet attempted to address the issue of how the Israelites managed to become this great mutitude which swarmed over and fill the whole land, or how the Egyptians supposedly feared them because of it. Or how the Egyptians managed to make slaves out of a people who where greater than they were. I was at this point merely looking at the contradiction between the statement of Moses and that of Pharoah.

Moses is speaking directly to the children of Israel whom he brought out of Egypt, specifically TELLING THEM in Deuteronomy 7:7:

• YHUH did not set his love on you or choose you because you were more in number, for you were the FEWEST.

Even though in Exodus it says:

• Exodus 1
  7) And the children of Israel were fruitful and swarmed and multiplied and became very, very strong (or numerous); and the land was filled with them.
  8) And a new king arose over Egypt, who had not known Joseph.
  9) And he said to his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are abundant and stronger (or more numerous) than we.

[Stranger]

Ok, Sandy, You are going to make me look into the whole context if I don't have a quick answer on this shot. I still think it is a point in time...

"YHUH did not set his love on you or choose you because you were more in number, for you were the FEWEST."

My first question is, WHEN did it happen? Obviously not at the time. So how far back?

"And he said to his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are abundant and stronger (or more numerous) than we."

The few is in past tense. The many in present tense. In between you have the bees and the flowers, you know...

[Sandy]

Originally posted by Stranger
Ok, Sandy, You are going to make me look into the whole context if I don't have a quick answer on this shot. I still think it is a point in time...

"YHUH did not set his love on you or choose you because you were more in number, for you were the FEWEST."

My first question is, WHEN did it happen? Obviously not at the time. So how far back?

"And he said to his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are abundant and stronger (or more numerous) than we."

The few is in past tense. The many in present tense. In between you have the bees and the flowers, you know...

Stranger,

• Who was Pharoah talking about and when?
  Who is Moses talking to and when?

That will answer your are (present tense) and were (past tense).

[OldShepherd]

Sandy,

(JPS) Deu 7:7 The LORD did not set His love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people—for ye were the fewest of all peoples—

Exod 1:7 And the children of Israel were fruitful, and increased abundantly, and multiplied, and waxed exceeding mighty; and the land was filled with them.
8 Now there arose a new king over Egypt, who knew not Joseph.
9 And he said unto his people: ‘Behold, the people of the children of Israel are too many and too mighty for us;

10 come, let us deal wisely with them, lest they multiply (07235), and it come to pass, that, when there befalleth us any war, they also join themselves unto our enemies, and fight against us, and get them up out of the land.’

In your attempt to discredit the Bible you neglected to read the passage of scripture, you yourself posted. Note, in verse 10 the Egyptians were afraid that the Hebrews would multiply and become too powerful for them. Which is why the King ordered the midwives to kill all male Hebrew babies at birth.

07235 hbr rabah raw-baw’
a primitive root; TWOT - 2103,2104; v
AV - multiply 74, increase 40, much 29, many 28, more 12, great 8, long 3, store 2, exceedingly 2, greater 2, abundance 2, misc 24; 226
1) be or become great, be or become many, be or become much, be or become numerous
1a) (Qal)
1a1) to become many, become numerous, multiply (of people, animals, things)
1a2) to be or grow great
1b) (Piel) to make large, enlarge, increase, become many
1c) (Hiphil)
1c1) to make much, make many, have many
1c1a) to multiply, increase

15 And the king of Egypt spoke to the Hebrew midwives, of whom the name of the one was Shiphrah, and the name of the other Puah;
16 and he said: ‘When ye do the office of a midwife to the Hebrew women, ye shall look upon the birthstool: if it be a son, then ye shall kill him; but if it be a daughter, then she shall live.’
17 But the midwives feared God, and did not as the king of Egypt commanded them, but saved the men-children alive.

20 And God dealt well with the midwives; and the people multiplied, and waxed very mighty.

As for Deut 7:7. When did YHWH choose his people? When they were in Egypt or when He called one man, Abraham out of all the pagans in Ur and told Him that his descendants would become as numerous as the stars? This is a case of deliberately twisting the text to prove your agenda.

All quotes from the Jewish Publication Society translation, by real Hebrew scholars. Not pagan atheists.