No announcement yet.

cain and able - an unusual perspective

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • cain and able - an unusual perspective

    Cain and Abel - the origin of the devil explained

    The story of Cain and Abel is well know to us, but how many of us see this story as telling us where the devil originates? Here is the story for those less familiar and to which I can quote various parts.

    Genesis 4
    2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
    3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.
    4 And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:
    5 But unto Cain and to his offering he had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.
    6 And the LORD said unto Cain, Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen?
    7 If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
    8 And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him.
    9 And the LORD said unto Cain, Where is Abel thy brother? And he said, I know not: Am I my brother's keeper?
    10 And he said, What hast thou done? the voice of thy brother's blood crieth unto me from the ground.
    11 And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
    12 When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
    13 And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
    14 Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.
    15 And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him. The devil is no more than part of man's nature. The origin of the devil is within man and without exception we have some devil in us all. When we look in the mirror, we are looking at the devil.

    Any story or reference in the Bible in which the devil is mentioned is in connection with the actions of man. There is no exception to this. Closely associated to this are Satan and the Serpent and can be attributed to man. The most well-known reference to Satan is that when Jesus called his disciple Peter; "Satan". This is surprising when we consider just a few verses earlier, we read of Peter commended by Jesus for recognizing who Jesus was; But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ. If we do as some will do and take an isolated verse to prove a point and be fixated on only one possible interpretation, we would have to conclude Satan has been identified and is Peter. This would mean Peter is Satan in the book of Job. Any other reference to Satan must be referring to Peter.

    If we believe that, we come across another set of difficulties. Satan cannot be a fallen Angel of God, if Satan is Peter. Peter must have pre-existed and been accused by God; as in Zechariah 3:2 The LORD rebuke thee, O Satan;. Did Peter reveal he had pre-existed? Did Jesus ever refer to Peter as Satan again after that one event? No! To link Satan with only Peter sounds absurd from what I have just illustrated. If this sounds absurd and you say; "why cannot Satan refer to something or somebody else?", then why not give the same latitude to considering what the Devil and the Serpent are?

    God's enemy has only been man. God has not accused his Angels of being his enemy and though it is a different subject, there is not strong evidence to support the idea that God's Angel sin. It is not a phrase that should be written or said. I only mention that now, for when the true nature of the Devil is known, the possibility of Angels sinning is non-existent. When Peter said; "the angels that sinned", the same story recalled by Jude, the "angels" are found to be human. For a full explanation see the thread; The angels of Jude 6 It was necessary to get that out of the way in order to fend off the obvious comments and questions which would follow and I have no wish to go through the same set of questions as I have already answered in that thread.

    Cain is example of man's nature that is the source of evil. What Cain did, we would naturally say is wrong. Is that said by all? No. If it were, we would not have murderers today. Murderers have no regard for the life of the person they kill. We are not told God gave any written law to the descendants of Adam and Eve. The law was not written down until it was given to Moses in the wilderness. "Thou shalt not kill" became law number 6, after the law to honour mother and father at number 5. Of all the prohibitive laws against our neighbour; "do not kill" was number 1 because it is the most serious. We honour mother and father, because they have given us life. They have nurtured us and raised us to a mature age, to where we can fend for ourselves. It is a sad indictment that parents these days do not bring up their children in the way that earns them respect. After commandment number 5 we begin the commandments specific to our neighbour.

    In contrast to honouring parents for giving us life, since we regard our own life as precious, so we ought to regard the life of others. This is fundamental and is part of the second great commandment summed up by Jesus in which, by two commandments, Jesus summed up all the law that was given to Moses. It should not have to be told us we must "not kill", that should be innate in us. Nevertheless, some people have to be told this before they realize that killing others is not acceptable. Hence the "do unto others as you would have them do to you" should be our overriding principle. It was not the case with Cain and we have to see the reason why.

    Nowhere in this story is Cain influenced by an external agent to commit his crime. His crime stems from his offering to God not being accepted and in some extent jealousy toward his brother Abel, whose offering was accepted. Cain became so angry that his anger was uncontrollable. He did not overcome the urge to kill his brother to get some from of self-gratification. Before Cain killed Abel, and after Cain's offering had not been accepted, God asked Cain a set of questions; Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? Look at the observation of God; and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. Sin can be likened to cat crouched ready to pounce on its prey; once the door is open, the opportunity arises. Cain did not do well and instead of admitting his mistake and saying; Lord forgive me, I will do better next time. Instead, his emotions got the better of him and he killed Abel.

    Emotions are a function of the brain/mind. Our emotions are what we can think of as our "heart"; not the heart that pumps blood. Our thoughts can manifest in to our actions and our actions are governed by our emotions. It is up to us to exercise self-control and govern our emotions. Cain was not able to do this, and his anger resulted in sin; the killing his brother. No-one else was to blame other than Cain.

    The origin of sin is also explained in James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man: 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death. 16 Do not err, my beloved brethren. James says; "do not err" (on this subject). The origin of the devil and man's sin is in himself. It is man's own lust that draws him and entices him and gives birth (conceives) sin. There is no-one else to blame.

    God is not tempting man, and that means God is not letting another agent or using any other agent to tempt man. If God allowed an Angel to tempt man, that is as good as God himself tempting man. Given that God has no involvement in making men sin, the blame rests solely on man alone.


  • #2
    cain and abel cont... an unusal perspective...

    There is a verse in the Book of Revelation which links the Devil and Satan and the Serpent. They are all facets of the same manifestation of evil that originates in the mind of man;(Rev 12:9) that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: Satan, the Devil and the Serpent are one of the same. Eve was tempted by the serpent in her mind and Jesus was tempted by the Devil in his mind. They are all functions of the mind of man. Satan means the "adversary". The Devil means; "the accuser". The serpent is known for lying. Eve was deceived by her own lie and Jesus did not give in to thoughts that would lead him to sin. This is brought into context when Jesus said (John 8:44); Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. We are all the descendants of Adam, we all have his nature. This means we have the devil, satan and the serpent in us all; the same as was in Adam and Eve with the potential to lead us to sin. So then, Eve deceived herself by her reasoning; she believed her own lie and Adam was guilty for following his wife's disobedience. Cain was the first murderer and guilty of breaking an unwritten law (at that time); a crime of the most serious kind against a fellow human being.

    Given that everything we have ever done is retained in our memory, the memory of what we have done is our accuser. We stand accused by our own sin originated within us. All the wrong things we have done in God's sight are known to him. Our nature accuses us by the actions we have done. The only way to succeed (as Jesus succeeded) is to have the same mind as Christ. Paul writes; Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Getting the mind of Christ has to be worked at. As Paul describes in Ephesians chapter 4, it requires the putting off the "old man" with all his evil thoughts and put on the "new man" with pure thoughts.

    It was at the end of Jesus' mortal life when Jesus finally defeated the devil that was in him. "It is finished" included the defeating of the Devil when he was on the cross. He had conquered the devil, the devil had never got the better of him, he had overcome all that part of his nature that gave him the propensity to sin. After his death and at the resurrection, Jesus could never be tempted again. The same can be for us, when we are given immortal bodies at the resurrection. Immortality takes away all, man's greed and competitiveness; those things that make us lust and give rise to sin. The kingdom of God gives no need for anyone to have the need to be better than anyone else. There is unlimited time never to have to have things immediately to satisfy a fear of loss. Every reason for sinning is taken away. Those who have struggled to achieve perfection (as Jesus achieved it), will be made perfect, when bestowed with an immortal body and all temptation and lust within the mind is no longer an entity.

    Jesus said; I have overcome the world. Everything he saw in the lives of those in the world, who have no regard for God and who are hedonistic and "lovers of pleasure" and would have been a temptation to Jesus, is the same world which tempts us to conform to its ways now and entice us to its pleasurable things which are not in the long-term do not give us lasting pleasure. Hence those of us prepared to forgo the way of the world and refuse to accept "the pleasures of sin for a season" and suffer the hardship of not giving in. The "world" represents all the ungodly people in whose minds come all the evil that is in their world. The "world" is there luring the godly to conform to its ways. As the devil in Jesus wanted Jesus to serve himself instead of God and tried to lure him by gratification of having the world worship him, so Jesus recalled scripture; the antidote to temptation. That is how easy it can be to get the Devil to flee from you as Jesus said; resist the devil and he will flee from you. The simple answer is keep one's mind focussed on the things of God. Jesus had in his mind on the word of God and that word sustained him and thoughts of temptation were overcome . Whenever, there was temptation, Jesus prayed to God and recalled scripture, because he knew what the will of God was and he did not let his own selfish thoughts get the better of his desire to please God.

    Look at every place in the Bible where Satan, the Devil and the Serpent are mentioned and find the connection with man. Once this connection is seen, all reasons to blame God or his Angels are removed. At a stroke, the man-made myths to do with Angels are done away with. Don't let the lying nature of others deceive you and do not let yourself be deceived by your own nature. Unless you agree to the origin of sin, as spoken of by James, you err and James says; "do not err". Be very clear about the origin of sin and who is to be blamed. Confront the devil that is your nature, and prevail, and when you do not prevail, seek forgiveness in God through Jesus. Jesus has paid the price necessary whereby those who believe according to John 3:16 can be saved. Approach God with a contrite heart and with repentance, determined to avoid the same mistakes, and God will forgive you. (Isaiah 66:2) but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.. Get wisdom and get understanding and know who the real devil is.

    written on biblewheel .com


    • #3
      I can see this point made by David... ...

      in reality, a person can have no thoughts of evil, yet SUDDENLY some weird ugly thought of evil will invade the i ask where did this OUTSIDE thought of evil spring from....

      so where did this INJECTED THOUGHT come from...????????

      all very interesing,


      • #4
        the ?can be asked in our reality world....

        why can we be thinking one thing and suddenly have evil thoughts, we did not think of 1 second prior too this temptation.

        injected thinking from an outside source....????


        although this perspective seems valid, I don't believe this is so............


        Eve has not formed, when God told Adam not to eat from the Tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

        She was DECEIVED by the devil, whom Jesus named 'the father of lies'.
        deception in itself is not a sin, for deception is a LYING TRICK, a ruse, a con,

        What is THE sin-, is acting upon deception as if is was the truth and this is what Eve did.
        Of course this whole scenario, goes with the advice saying ''My people PERISH from lack of knowledge'' - Eve did lack this knowledge ' not to eat from that tree'. Adam did not and is the 1 man who brought sin into the world.

        I have also read of a testimony of Howard Pitmam author of Placebo where this man actually saw into the demonic realm and goes on to describe the demons and how they looked.

        SO I will stay with the reality that demons do exist outside of the human mind, however they do inject and influence flawed men to commit their evil deeds....or... MANKIND CO OPERATES with evil because of ignorance.
        Last edited by LucySmith; 07-10-2013, 07:56 PM.