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Nicodemus - THE RULER OF THE JEWS [under the law]

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  • Nicodemus - THE RULER OF THE JEWS [under the law]

    LIVED IN THE VERY DEPTHS OF DARKNESS.
    BUT BUT BUT..................

    this man was the great ruler of the law of moses to his nation and lived under great darkness.
    THIS NATION, LIVED AS CAPTIVES AND NICODEMUS LIVED AS A RULER OF CAPTIVES.

    MESSIAH corrected his mindset.

    SO I ASK THIS ?
    shall you be taught by the Saviour's Spirit and be free - or shall you be deceived into thinking you need some ''works of the law'' to save you - notice the LAW DID NOT SAVE THE RULER NICODEMUS.... not 1 law saved him BUT MESSIAH CHATTERED TO HIM AND NICODEMUS CAME OUT FROM THE DARK OF HELL AND WAS RELEASED INTO LIFE.

    now its your turn - sit the the darkness of the law of moses to the jew by keeping some of it as a captive or be released into LIFE IN THE SPIRIT.

    here and now is ''CHOICES''
    I FULLY REJECT ANY PART OF LAW KEEPING TO THE JEW.
    READ ACTS 15.
    I KEEP others 4 things asked of me by the Holy Spirit's decission I DONT ADD THE LAW OF MOSES to the holy Spirit directive. ......................................................
    actually it is such a clearly defined subject i wonder how anyone could even consider keeping some parts of the law of moses.
    religious people are very strange
    it is like the ''church'' discussing homosexuality - like what is there to discuss?

  • #2
    Originally posted by LucySmith View Post
    i wonder how anyone could even consider keeping some parts of the law of moses.
    religious people are very strange it is like the ''church'' discussing homosexuality - like what is there to discuss?
    Hi Lucy, my point exactly, what is there to discuss. The Law of Moses forbids homosexuality, so why should there be a discussion, it's wrong, it's a sin, but there are delusional thinkers out there which think you don't have to follow the Law of Moses, so homosexuality is OK...who wants to be cursed by not having the freedom to choose your sexual preference. Didn't "Christ" shed his blood so you don't have to be under that law? Shame Shame. ImAHebrew
    Col 2:16 & 17 Teaches us that no "man" is to determine what we eat or drink, or how the Sabbath, Holy Days, and New Moon should be observed, instead, The Body of Messiah IS to determine those things, just like what happened in Acts 15.

    Now, The Body of Messiah determined that since Moses is READ every Sabbath in the Synagogues (Acts 15:21), the Gentiles would be able to HEAR (Luke 16:31, John 5:46-47), and then do those things to farewell (Acts 15:29). Those FOUR necessary commands that The Body of Messiah determined for the Gentiles, were FROM the Law of Moses.
    Abstain from meats offered to idols
    (Exo 34:15), abstain from blood (Lev 17:14), abstain from things strangled (Deu 12:23), and abstain from fornication (Lev 19:29).
    So do not let anyone deceive you into believing falsely about the Law of Moses.

    Comment


    • #3
      IAH - please allow me to explain

      with the Law to the jew or without the law to the jew, all men have a conscience.
      a little child without any law or instruction knows right from wrong unless mentally retarded.
      all people are without excuses when it comes to wickedness.
      those people in nations outside of Israel knew their own wickedness for every man is birthed in iniquity.
      a fallen state.

      no matter how much the popular media play up ''homosexuality'' as a normal condition - every human knows it is wrong because people hide it and dont do it in public. sin is a conscience thing not a law thing.
      beside today all men are just as wicked with the law or without the law to the jew.
      admittedly the ''law to the jew'' may have magnified it more to that nation- but the tree of the knowledge of good and evil did not begin with Moses but Adam.
      ---------------------------------------------

      there is hope NICODEMUS found it IN HIS SAVIOUR....
      as all Believers do amen.

      IAH no one needs to go to university to graduate in evil.

      def of conscience.

      a: the sense or consciousness of the moral goodness or blameworthiness of one's own conduct, intentions, or character together with a feeling of obligation to do right or be good

      Comment


      • #4
        Conscience

        Originally posted by LucySmith View Post
        sin is a conscience thing not a law thing.
        Hi Lucy, hey, I think I know what you mean, and so did the writer of Hebrews:

        Heb 10:24-25 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: (25) Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.

        You see, IT IS A CONSCIENCE THING, to do good works, not FORSAKING the ASSEMBLING of ourselves together. Hey, have a great assembly today so that you won't defile your conscience by not REMEMBERING to assemble together. Happy Sabbath. ImAHebrew

        BTW, how often and on what day do you think the writer of Hebrews was speaking about in their, "not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together?"
        Col 2:16 & 17 Teaches us that no "man" is to determine what we eat or drink, or how the Sabbath, Holy Days, and New Moon should be observed, instead, The Body of Messiah IS to determine those things, just like what happened in Acts 15.

        Now, The Body of Messiah determined that since Moses is READ every Sabbath in the Synagogues (Acts 15:21), the Gentiles would be able to HEAR (Luke 16:31, John 5:46-47), and then do those things to farewell (Acts 15:29). Those FOUR necessary commands that The Body of Messiah determined for the Gentiles, were FROM the Law of Moses.
        Abstain from meats offered to idols
        (Exo 34:15), abstain from blood (Lev 17:14), abstain from things strangled (Deu 12:23), and abstain from fornication (Lev 19:29).
        So do not let anyone deceive you into believing falsely about the Law of Moses.

        Comment


        • #5
          u r all theory iah

          a cloud without substance.



          YOU SEE YOU ARE DEFEATED BY SABBATHGATE 1888.
          the whole point you try to make and failing is based up an assumption we all have to keep some parts of the law to the jew.


          that is your starting point - that is a proven lie.
          from adam down all men had a conscience - a moral compass - the law to the jew did not reset this compass,it may have highlighted it more but did not take it away.

          you tell me o go back under this law to the jew [when i am a gentile] to save me from my sin and do ''works''.

          sabbathgate1888 has really proven this theory of religious man wrong.

          in christ my conscious is wonderfull. Grace abounds.
          I seek not to disgrace my gift of grace.
          I learnt ''sin does not pay''.

          that is one thing i do find IAH - he washes my sins away by the blood of the lamb and the training up into the word - there is DIVINE ENERGY WITHIN THE WORD - some call it a ''vibration'' [sounds new age ] but i like the word EMPOWERMENT - TO CEASE FROM SIN.
          to be able to say NO to sin and actually mean it.

          Jesus told some ''Go and sin no more''
          did He lie?
          Did he giggle secretly to himself thinking they will never stop sinning
          '' Go and sin NO more''- a moral decission of our conscious that God part in us all that moves us one way or another.
          Jesus spoke the truth - He was saying
          ...............''dont allow another being to rule your mind with evil. Use you own mind that man of the Spirit to make your choices for you so satan as NO hold upon you as he has NO hold upon Me.''

          empowered to cease from things that upset my Father.
          empowered to choose correctly - NICODEMUS learnt this as he spoke with the Messiah.

          you know something very sad IAH - when you wish to do ''works' from the law to the jew by keeping the sabbathgate - you are really smacking Messiah in the face, spitting upon Him in the market place and booing Him on the cross - why? - because you dont feel His sacrifice was good enough to SAVE YOU AND HEAL YOU AND MAKE YOU WHOLE.

          ''unhappy sabbath'' UAH - for in keeping it you are among the ''despisers of Christ'' + a jew by nature
          Funny thing IAH - all these jewish despisers reaped the seeds of their decission in70ad as they lay dying in the streets of Jerusalem. I wonder how many died in the ''street of Chains''.?


          BTW i ''assemble'' each day
          hehehhe.......................
          i love it.
          also BTW - your childish rendering of the NT is an abomination.
          watch out for it - it desolates you.

          Comment


          • #6
            cont... it would be very hard to break away from a compulsive religious disorder

            such as sabbath keeping as it would be giving up a ''religious drug'' -rather like giving up rosary beads and Mary worship - a religious addiction of deception - or- a cruel demonic control, that makes a person a slave to lies and ends up lining them up to be ''murdered'' by the law of sin and death.


            it is a very powerfull religious drug~!!!!


            the sabbatherianism creeds are very hard and ofcourse very boring taskmasters and as Peter said '' IT WAS A YOKE NO MAN COULD BEAR''- PERHAPS the same old same old boring repetition got people ''down and depressed''. It is very boring to be tied to rote and have NO liberty.

            To do the repeated ''works'' that would lead to RSI in modern terms. [repeditive strain injury] or Occupational Overuse Syndrome (OOS)

            so if we look now at a person trying to ''give up their former sabbath keeping ways'' it would like giving up a mega addiction problem.

            So the religious person simply cannot do this without divine intervention.
            hence they argue for their ''habit'' and cannot bear the thought of absentance. not too many reform from her clutches.

            ------------------------

            to study and addiction/habit that is repressive and dangerous - we look at the ''effects'' this habit would have and a hold [of satan's] upon the addict trying hard to WITHDRAW from such a religious addiction.
            Unless divine intervention happens NONE escape.

            -----------------------

            The 1st thing noticed would be a pew person's decission to quit.... because THE TRUTH had been shown to them - but ''her [sabbath keeping ] revenge would be very exacting'' because ''the sabbath'' NEEDS TO BE WORSHIPPED SO VERY FEW could get thru the weekend without a tug back to their former worship of a system now defunked.


            ummm
            some try COLD TURKEY.
            this is the general way for the sincere kickers as the Holy Spirit supplies the divine strength to withdraw gracefully.

            you see ''sabbath worship'' is like a malignant lover who will not let go too easily.
            some try hypnotism, to resist the temptation to the call of their ''former lover''.

            ''she'' [the whore of Babylon's falseness] is irrestible and so acts like A SPURNED LOVER and allows ''guilt'' to send the pew person scurring back into ''her'' deceiving arms.

            yes indeed
            very few sabbatherians CAN give up their worship to the idol of works in the OT.

            perhaps the greatest joy would to be released from this curse of the law to the jew and committed to the gift of divine grace.
            My most divine blessing is to walk beside My Saviour in the shadow of His Grace.

            have you ever considered adjusting your personal theology to Father's?
            the time is short for the change over, as His watchmen on the walls are calling out ''the change is coming fast''

            ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------


            BTW this world is rushing headlong into MASSIVE CHANGES.....
            the Governments and the banks of the nations know well THIS WORLD AS WE KNOW IT TODAY will not continue in the same old ways.
            the Physical natural shall cease and the spiritually normal [reconcilliation] shall increase.

            They KNOW ALREADY this is so. THEY ARE SCARED.

            The world is wiser than the church.


            The DIVINE ENERGY THAT OVERCOMES DEATH is gathering within the Believer/overcomers.

            mark well the time is short and if you are outside Father's personal theology of HIS SON EMMANUEL and do not walk in the same belief nor under His grace - it is not good sign.
            infact it would be best to simply imagine the worst. Why not change LO AMMI TO ''MY PEOPLE''?
            UMMM.

            Comment


            • #7
              ALL THE DO'S AND DONT/S religious people tell others to do

              still has never made anyone into the Image of Messiah - just the same as all the dos and donts never made anyone but 2[caleb and elijah] receive LIFE AND BLESSING.

              THE WHOLE PROGRAMMES HAVE FAILED.
              THE WHOLE SYSTEM has failed LIFE AND BLESSINGS.

              iF YOU WERE THE HEAD RULER of the jews - i dont think you would a 1/2 wit - do you.
              I do believe someone like Nicodemus would be very smart, an action man, full of vigor for his belief -but one day - he stopped and looked and listened to a far GREATER RULER AND A FAR SMARTER MAN than himself so he went to the Saviour at night and in secret to ask some questions.
              Jesus said ''you have to be BORN AGAIN''.

              if we think deeply on this born again experience Messiah told of - not too many are for if they were - they would be His Image.

              people mouth off ' i am a born again christian' = the evidence is - POOR YOU.
              the true evidence is ALL AGAINST YOU - even Jesus who said to the Laodicean church - ''you are miserable naked wretched and blind'' - why? because like Nicodemus these people dwell UNDER MAN'S RULERSHIP.

              lo ammi is man ruled
              Nicodemus was man ruled
              the christian system is man ruled.
              a gobblygook of 1/2 truths mixed with lies that makes to whole idea on Life and blessings voided.
              NICODEMUS SAW THE VOID.

              do u?

              do you have enough courage and common sense to walk away from a failed system and sit at the feet of the Saviour and learn from HIM.
              are you smart enough to realise ''we have been sold a sham''?
              are you smart enough to realise - TO BE born again TO study, BE seeking TRUE understanding is NOT ANY TYPE OF AMERICAN/ EUROPEAN CHURCH EVANGELISM.

              can u get this thru your head?

              the Saviour is the ONLY ONE TO SAVE.

              SAVED IS NOT DYING AND GOING TO HEAVEN AND ESCAPING HELL.

              SAVED IS A NEW CREATION FREED FROM SATAN AND FREED FROM OURSELVES - TO LIVE FRUITFULLY as a Godchild on earth - just like Messiah did, to enter into the realm of eternal life here by the power of the resurrection working daily inside your being., His arising spiritual powers that are eternal.

              to be born again - is not easy - it is hard to rethink our plight.
              to be born again - is the total transformation of our mind and the way we think.
              to be born again - makes our soul agree with our true inner man [ the Godpart spirit], so we become 1 flesh meaning the soul/will/ emotions do as they are told by the godman -spiritual man our true being inside .
              in other words A CHANGE OF MASTER.
              our master becomes our born again raised up spirit awakened and quicked into LIFE.

              THEN WE CAN SAY JOHN 10 V 10 =''I CAME TO BRING FORTH LIFE ABUNDANT''. hurrah i have received this.

              it is time to learn how to function in the realm of the spirit. [ to allow the Godchild in you to be Lord]
              this Godchild - this spiritual you in a clay body is not religious - infact will shun all forms of any religion.
              this Godchild - awakens you to the person called the truth and the resurrection and He comes to dwell in you as an incorruptable seed.
              [john 15]
              coming alive to a dimension that is mostly unknown or rarely experienced by man, is one of the greatest gifts the Father is bestowing upon His sons.

              YOU WILL NEVER have A GREATER pal, than one who will stick by you and tell you the truth and not agree with you when you are wrong. That is not a friend.
              friends are few.
              but Messiah is a friend thru our thick and thin by His grace - BECAUSE GRACE KNOWS how to bring an end to our faith and see His child COMPLETED IN HIM. HE KNOWS WE ARE ALREADY COMPLETED.
              It is in this climate of upheaval and change that we see the Father bringing forth teaching and a deeper understanding of the realm of the Spirit.
              Spying knows of life but still remains inside a man made religion. It is not possible to mix life with death successfully. He should review the ''founders'' of his belief to see if they have survived into abundant life and blessing.
              ? = where is THEIR LIFE OF BLESSING.
              IF YOU DONT SEE LIFE - YOU DONT SEE THE SAVIOUR NOR HIS POWER THAT RAISED HIM UP FROM THE DEAD.
              all u see is ''religious talk''.

              Abba is drawing His sons beyond the realm of "faith" as we have known it, into a state of being, a state of knowing.

              Spying....
              i know u cannot hear me your law-keeping to the jew only- stands in the way [sigh] but it will not stop me, from saying to you YOU NEED TO COME INTO A STATE OF ''BEING LIFE''.

              at this time you only know of it.

              The lawkeeping is killing YOUR BEING as it did all others who tried to keep it but failed. I dont wish you to fail.

              Comment


              • #8
                The Law is Spiritual

                Originally posted by LucySmith View Post
                The lawkeeping is killing YOUR BEING as it did all others who tried to keep it but failed. I dont wish you to fail.
                Hi Lucy, neither does Messiah and that is why:

                Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

                And that brings me to another question for you. The Apostle Paul said that the Law is Spiritual (Rom 7:14). Can you share your thoughts as to how you think the Law is Spiritual? ImAHebrew
                Col 2:16 & 17 Teaches us that no "man" is to determine what we eat or drink, or how the Sabbath, Holy Days, and New Moon should be observed, instead, The Body of Messiah IS to determine those things, just like what happened in Acts 15.

                Now, The Body of Messiah determined that since Moses is READ every Sabbath in the Synagogues (Acts 15:21), the Gentiles would be able to HEAR (Luke 16:31, John 5:46-47), and then do those things to farewell (Acts 15:29). Those FOUR necessary commands that The Body of Messiah determined for the Gentiles, were FROM the Law of Moses.
                Abstain from meats offered to idols
                (Exo 34:15), abstain from blood (Lev 17:14), abstain from things strangled (Deu 12:23), and abstain from fornication (Lev 19:29).
                So do not let anyone deceive you into believing falsely about the Law of Moses.

                Comment


                • #9
                  umm i thought it best to use an edification so u will no longer be ignorant IAH

                  the excerpt from his book, pages 261-265.



                  Excerpt:



                  Scripture shows that the Sabbath of the Fourth Commandment was inseparably linked with the Sinaitic Covenant, the words of which are the Ten Commandments.
                  The Sabbath commandment was in the very center of the Sinaitic Covenant and was the sign of that covenant.
                  While circumcision was the entrance sign for the sons of Israel, the Sabbath served as the repeatable sign Israel was commanded to "remember." The Sabbath is related to every aspect of the Sinaitic Covenant: the covenant itself, the tabernacle of the covenant, the worship of the covenant, the people of the covenant, the land of the covenant, and the blessings and the cursings of the covenant. The laws for observance of the Sabbath were laws of the Sinaitic Covenant.
                  There are no laws for Sabbath observance outside of the Sinaitic Covenant.

                  Therefore, if one is going to observe the Sabbath of Sinai, he must do so in accordance with the laws of Sinai.


                  From the teaching and actions of Jesus we learned that He is the new covenant center.
                  He took authority over the old covenant and was continually trying to move the Jewish leaders’ reference point of authority away from Sinai to Himself.
                  It was the questionable Sabbath activity of Jesus, coupled with His claim to be the son of God, which infuriated the Jewish leaders and caused the events which led to His crucifixion. Jesus knew the rigid framework of Judaism could not hold the dynamics of the new covenant gospel of justification by faith in Christ.

                  The New Testament defines the old or first covenant as the "tablets of stone" and the laws "written with ink." The epistles, in contextual teaching, state that the Sinaitic Covenant is not binding in any way upon the Christian.
                  This covenant, which was good for its time, has been superseded by the new, better covenant.
                  The new covenant law of love interpreted by the New Testament writings and applied under the guidance of the Holy Spirit far surpasses the laws given to Israel.
                  Scripture makes it clear, however, that the moral principles upon which many of the Sinaitic Covenant laws were based are included in the moral principles of the new covenant.
                  However, in the new covenant there is a different administration of the moral principles, and the new covenant has different signs. Baptism in the new covenant takes the place of circumcision in the old, and the Lord’s supper in the new covenant replaces the Sabbath in the old.


                  Under the new covenant the emphasis is no longer on sign and symbol, rather it is on reality and relationship.

                  There are no long lists of minutely detailed laws, rather the new covenant is characterized by general principles which have application to all nations and cultures, not just the sons of Israel in the promised land. The epistles teach that Christians can add nothing to the righteousness provided for them in Christ.

                  Those who seek to add their own works of obedience to the perfect, finished work of Christ by keeping any of the observances of the old covenant are in serious danger of falling from grace.
                  The new covenant writings show one cannot pick and choose among the old covenant laws. If one is seeking to be under Sinaitic law, he must be under the whole law. However, to do this is to fall from grace.



                  There is no biblical evidence which proves the Sabbath of the seventh day was transferred to the first day of the week. While there are many important events which transpired on the first day of the week, there is no biblical command to keep it holy.



                  Nevertheless, it appears that the first day of the week did have significance to New Testament believers because of the important events which happened on that day. It is necessary that Christians have a time to worship. It is necessary that time be given to pursue the things of God, yet the first day should never be seen in the same light as the Sabbath of the old covenant. Rather, the emphasis is on what happens rather than on when it happens.

                  There is no discussion regarding the Sabbath in the book of Acts, rather the discussion about law is on the topic of circumcision. This is to be expected because circumcision was the entrance sign for the old covenant community and the Sabbath did not apply unless one was a member of the covenant community.



                  Nearly every ceremony in the old covenant in some way pointed forward to the work of Christ.
                  The seventh-day Sabbath is no exception. While it pointed back to the perfect relationship which existed between God and man on Eden’s seventh day, it also pointed forward to the time when that relationship would be restored.
                  The writer of Hebrews unequivocally shows that the rest which remains for the Christian is not the seventh-day Sabbath of Sinai, nor is it the "rest" which Israel experienced under the leadership of Joshua or David. Rather, the rest of the new covenant is the "rest" of a restored relationship between man and God similar to the rest of creation’s seventh day, which one enters by believing.



                  All the Sinaitic Sabbaths -- seventh-day Sabbaths, seasonal sabbaths, sabbatical years and Jubilee -- seem to have been like small oases in the desert where the sons of Israel pretended they were back in the Garden of Eden.
                  These Sabbaths not only pointed back to that seventh-day rest of creation, but they pointed forward to the restored relationship which was to take place within the new covenant: the fellowship of the Holy Spirit indwelling the heart of the believer who is saved by grace.
                  These sabbaths served a very important function in giving purpose, direction and hope to the people of Israel. But like the dozens of other pointers, which were also shadows of good things to come, their value ended in the presence of the Creator. Jesus drew all these old covenant signs and shadows of hope to Himself.



                  The Pharisees demonstrated the heartbreaking paradox of old covenant Sabbath law.
                  The laws that were designed to point forward to the open fellowship between man and God were the very laws which blinded their eyes to the present reality of the Creator standing in their midst. Jesus said, "You search the Scriptures, because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is these that bear witness of Me; and you are unwilling to come to Me, that you may have life" (Jn. 5:38,39).



                  The actions of the Pharisees can be likened to a person driving from the East Coast of the U.S. to visit California’s Yosemite Valley. For thousands of miles the traveler has been following a road map to Yosemite. During this time he becomes so intent on watching the map -- lest he make a wrong turn -- that when he reaches Yosemite he fails to see the beauty of the country. With one eye on the road the other on the map he drives through Yosemite Valley without ever seeing El Capitan, Half Dome or Yosemite Falls. Finding a parking place, with his eyes still glued to his packet of instructions, he reads about the beautiful park but never leaves the seat of his car to personally walk the trails and never lifts his eyes to the majesty above.



                  The map and trail guide served important functions. But upon arrival at the destination it is time to put the map down and look up. So it is with the Sabbath. Rather than seek to keep a day holy let us put the day down and step into the arms of our holy Creator. Let us enter "today" into fellowship, into a "rest" which remains for those who have believed.

                  http://www.ratzlaf.com.

                  an edification from a former ex Sda
                  <*]]]]<

                  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi Lucy, again I ask. How is the Law of Moses "Spiritual?" Blessings in the Name, ImAHebrew
                    Col 2:16 & 17 Teaches us that no "man" is to determine what we eat or drink, or how the Sabbath, Holy Days, and New Moon should be observed, instead, The Body of Messiah IS to determine those things, just like what happened in Acts 15.

                    Now, The Body of Messiah determined that since Moses is READ every Sabbath in the Synagogues (Acts 15:21), the Gentiles would be able to HEAR (Luke 16:31, John 5:46-47), and then do those things to farewell (Acts 15:29). Those FOUR necessary commands that The Body of Messiah determined for the Gentiles, were FROM the Law of Moses.
                    Abstain from meats offered to idols
                    (Exo 34:15), abstain from blood (Lev 17:14), abstain from things strangled (Deu 12:23), and abstain from fornication (Lev 19:29).
                    So do not let anyone deceive you into believing falsely about the Law of Moses.

                    Comment

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